Latest topics | » THE DISTINGUISHED CONDUCT MEDAL![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Sep 05, 2024 11:16 pm by Julian Whybra » 61451 John Evans. Able Seaman.![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Sep 04, 2024 5:15 pm by Matthew Turl » 9312 Sapper H Cuthbert 5th Field Coy RE![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Sep 04, 2024 11:53 am by Julian Whybra » Who’s who in this photo?![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Sep 03, 2024 12:44 pm by ianwood » Sir Robert William Jackson ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Sep 02, 2024 10:24 am by Julian Whybra » Memorial to Wolseley![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Sep 01, 2024 8:47 pm by John Young » Lieutenant & Adjutant Spencer Frederick Chichester, 2nd 21st![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Sep 01, 2024 7:52 pm by Rory Reynolds » Last of the 24th at Isandhlwana![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Sep 01, 2024 7:51 am by Julian Whybra » On this day 28th August, 1879![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Sep 01, 2024 7:28 am by Julian Whybra » Alfred Ducat - N.N.C. Help with plotting his career![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Aug 29, 2024 6:58 pm by Rory Reynolds » Corporal James Frowen Williams F Company. ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Aug 29, 2024 8:46 am by Julian Whybra » Army Pay Department Personnel![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Aug 25, 2024 11:51 pm by Julian Whybra » Baron Von Steitencron![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Aug 25, 2024 10:32 am by Julian Whybra » Troop Despatch ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Aug 24, 2024 10:15 pm by Eddie » Private 35/1430 James Priddle 1/13th Regiment![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Aug 24, 2024 8:09 am by Roobie257 » Zulu powder horn![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Aug 23, 2024 5:22 pm by Rob D » Telescope v. field glasses![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Aug 23, 2024 7:07 am by Julian Whybra » A Hungarian soldier in the Zulu War (?)![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Aug 21, 2024 5:14 am by 90th » 90th foot sgt T. Collins 214![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Aug 20, 2024 3:04 pm by johnman » Zulu "Corps"![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Aug 20, 2024 11:43 am by Hobbes » amaKwenke amabutho![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Aug 20, 2024 11:23 am by Hobbes » A story regarding Younghusband's charge. Hearsay or a possibility? ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Aug 18, 2024 5:48 pm by Danny1960 » Hill of the Sphinx for sale open to offers![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Aug 17, 2024 6:44 pm by ciroferrara » Information help please ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Aug 16, 2024 4:44 pm by Roobie257 » Capt. Geo. Shepstone![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Aug 13, 2024 4:14 pm by Julian Whybra » Thomas William george 58th regiment 1880’s SA![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Aug 13, 2024 12:05 pm by Alstar » Private John Scott 24th Regiment a fugitive at large![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Aug 11, 2024 7:50 pm by Julian Whybra » Sergt. Woods N.N.C.![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Aug 09, 2024 4:41 pm by Julian Whybra » Who led the Naval Brigade at Gingindlovu ?![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Aug 08, 2024 9:32 pm by Herbert West » Herbert's Zulu war models![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Aug 08, 2024 7:06 pm by Herbert West » Studies in the Zulu War volumes![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Aug 07, 2024 2:31 pm by Julian Whybra » 80th Foot Information Request![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Aug 06, 2024 6:28 pm by Bill8183 » Henderson and the NNH at Rorke's Drift ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Aug 05, 2024 7:53 pm by SRB1965 » Hamilton Browne's birthday![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Aug 05, 2024 2:41 pm by Julian Whybra » 4,000 registered members.![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Aug 04, 2024 6:21 pm by Julian Whybra |
September 2024 | Mon | Tue | Wed | Thu | Fri | Sat | Sun |
---|
| | | | | | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 | 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 | 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | 30 | | | | | | | Calendar |
|
Top posting users this month | |
New topics | » Memorial to Wolseley![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sun Sep 01, 2024 8:47 pm by John Young » On this day 28th August, 1879![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Wed Aug 28, 2024 10:37 am by John Young » Alfred Ducat - N.N.C. Help with plotting his career![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Mon Aug 26, 2024 1:34 pm by Rory Reynolds » Zulu powder horn![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Fri Aug 23, 2024 5:22 pm by Rob D » Troop Despatch ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Aug 22, 2024 12:18 am by Eddie » Who’s who in this photo?![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Tue Aug 20, 2024 3:53 am by Danny1960 » Hill of the Sphinx for sale open to offers![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Sat Aug 17, 2024 6:44 pm by ciroferrara » Information help please ![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Aug 15, 2024 7:40 pm by Roobie257 » amaKwenke amabutho![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/fa/empty.gif) Thu Aug 15, 2024 6:54 pm by Julian Whybra |
Zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. |
Due to recent events on this forum, we have now imposed a zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. All reports will be treated seriously, and will lead to a permanent ban of both membership and IP address.
Any member blatantly corresponding in a deliberate and provoking manner will be removed from the forum as quickly as possible after the event.
If any members are being harassed behind the scenes PM facility by any member/s here at 1879zuluwar.com please do not hesitate to forward the offending text.
We are all here to communicate and enjoy the various discussions and information on the Anglo Zulu War of 1879. Opinions will vary, you will agree and disagree with one another, we will have debates, and so it goes.
There is no excuse for harassment or bullying of anyone by another person on this site.
The above applies to the main frame areas of the forum.
The ring which is the last section on the forum, is available to those members who wish to partake in slagging matches. That section cannot be viewed by guests and only viewed by members that wish to do so. |
Fair Use Notice | Fair use notice.
This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner.
We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes.
We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website.
If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution. |
| | Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort | |
| | Author | Message |
---|
barry
![barry](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/695-62.jpg)
Posts : 947 Join date : 2011-10-21 Location : Algoa Bay
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Fri Dec 11, 2015 4:50 pm | |
| Hi All, For those interested in visiting the site of the old fort at Helpmekaar the grid loc is S 28deg 26.799'/E 30deg 24.971', or if you do not have a GPS , but rather a compass, use the following triangulaton; 100 paces on 238 deg from the left hand bend in the road to the NW of the Police station 70 paces from the pond, on 148deg 160 paces from the centre of the cemetery on 309deg 270 paces from the nearest point ( a tee junction) on the tarred road running NW past the Police station. All degrees are magnetic. Finding this will test the navigator in you.
regards
barry |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Fri Dec 11, 2015 5:49 pm | |
| Well done Barry you managed to locate it
|
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | barry
![barry](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/695-62.jpg)
Posts : 947 Join date : 2011-10-21 Location : Algoa Bay
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 10:10 am | |
| Hi Frank, Thanks, should have the hospital site pinned down shortly too.
rgards
barry |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 10:48 am | |
| Want me to make a prediction? |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | barry
![barry](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/695-62.jpg)
Posts : 947 Join date : 2011-10-21 Location : Algoa Bay
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Helpmekaar hospital Tue Dec 15, 2015 11:10 am | |
| Hi Frank,
Yes, go ahead.
barry |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 11:36 am | |
| This is a building that's intrigued me for years, nothing to do with the hospital but Ive paced it out over many years and I always come back to the conclusion its on the site of the old 'Store'. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 11:51 am | |
| Barry There was a sketch of the fort in the Graphic around middle of March 1879. Im busy searching with little success but from memory Im sure the hospital was marked.
|
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 12:06 pm | |
| If you log onto Google earth the old road is still visible, it cuts between the front of the Police Station and the old Supply store. As it bends around your grid point there is an old house/ruin to the South. Around ten metres to the West of its Southern corner were a group of around 6 old unmarked graves. Those were just outside the boundary of the old trench. If the position you indicated ( and Im positive your right) is compared with the old photos and sketches, in particular an old sketch that showed the line of the three sheds, the parapet and the camp in the distance it pretty well shows exactly where the main camp site was. Once the hospital tent was moved from the fort for the quarantine I suspect it was put between the fort and the camp site that would put it around 20 metres North east of the small dam and pretty close to the access farm road on the 'bend' of the Helpmakaar main road. Hope that makes sense?
Just my guess mate, would love you to be able to pin point exactly.
Cheers
PS You staying in JoBurg for Xmas or heading to the coast? |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | barry
![barry](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/695-62.jpg)
Posts : 947 Join date : 2011-10-21 Location : Algoa Bay
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: The Helpmekaar hospital Tue Dec 15, 2015 12:29 pm | |
| Hi Frank, Thanks for that. From what I already know I think those directions are very close. No, Jozi is not the place to stay for Christmas. We have a 06h00 flight booked with Mango for PLZ on Sunday. We plan to spend a week there enjoying all four seasons every day.
regards
barry
|
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 12:39 pm | |
| Barry [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Where the telegraph pole bisects the side of the hill, just above the shear face, was Henry Harfords Camp site with the NNC. Its an area ive wanted to explore for years and never got around to. A great portion of it hasn't been farmed and looks pretty original so I reckon a few 'artifacts' could be in evidence. Could be worth a look next time your in the area. We are heading out of town for Kruger for a couple of weeks then a slow drive down through Natal and the Battlefields then back to Cape town via Lesotho and the Eastern Cape. The tourists are welcome to the Town for a few weeks, prices are already climbing. Cheers mate |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 1:44 pm | |
| John Young The March edition of the Graphic has I think a map of Helpmakaar. Would you be able to access a copy?
Cheers |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | rusteze
![rusteze](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/134-77.png)
Posts : 2871 Join date : 2010-06-02
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:31 pm | |
| Gentlemen Is this the spot under discussion? [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Steve |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Tue Dec 15, 2015 8:06 pm | |
| Hi Steve Where the road takes a sharp bend take a bearing at around 8 oclock to the clump of trees. There is an old house that is close to the side of the fort. The small dam is upwards and to the left from there and that's the area I think the hospital area was. The old grave yard is at the bottom just where the word imagery is written. Cheers |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | rusteze
![rusteze](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/134-77.png)
Posts : 2871 Join date : 2010-06-02
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Wed Dec 16, 2015 5:21 pm | |
| Thanks Frank. Is the feint oblong in the grass sitting to the south of the sharp bend in the road (and butting up against the building) the outline of the fort? Here is the Graphic image you were after. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Steve |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Thu Dec 17, 2015 4:48 am | |
| Thanks Steve for that. I remembered the original hospital was inside the fort. I will mark up the google map a bit later in the day, time to take morning coffee to 'she who must be obeyed'. |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | Frank Allewell
![Frank Allewell](https://2img.net/u/1313/16/75/50/avatars/32-19.jpg)
Posts : 8572 Join date : 2009-09-21 Age : 77 Location : Cape Town South Africa
![Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort Thu Dec 17, 2015 7:01 am | |
| The area was surveyed in the mid 70s by Laband and Thompson for their book 'Field Guide to the war in Zululand and the defence of Natal'. (page 60). At that time a fairly large portion of the trench was still visible with the abutment at over 1 meter in height. The Eastern side had been swallowed up by the Wattle growing through. In 1990 the area was revisited by Knight and Castle for their book 'The Zulu War then and now' (One of my Favourite Books) and they commented then that there was virtually no sign of the trench or abutments save that a fire had destroyed some undergrowth and a section of the trench line was visible. The last time I was there was a year ago and there is nothing of any significance at all. The small dam wall could very well be a relic of the 1879 era but theres nothing to say it is save and except its appearance. The projected position of the hospital is purely my own idea, based on readings etc. There is a controversy over the position of the old road in that the famous photo of the fort seems to indicate a well worn area between the fort and the hill beyond, separating the graves from the fort. However the actual road position is still visible on aerial photography and ordnance survey maps. [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]Possibly then the well worn track in the photo could be the route the troops took from the camp/fort to the trading store. The actual camp was spread over a pretty large area with the NNC a couple of kilometres away overlooking the cliff face dropping down the escarpment and the other troops spreading across the flat lands to the North and North East of the fort. Some of the volunteers, Carbineers in particular camped well away from the imperial forces on the approach to the Knostrop pass itself. Hope that helps. Cheers |
| ![Go down](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | | | Geographic location of Helpmekaar fort | |
|
Similar topics | ![+](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) |
|
| Permissions in this forum: | You cannot reply to topics in this forum
| |
| |
| |