WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM

Film Zulu. Lieutenant John Chard: The army doesn't like more than one disaster in a day. Bromhead: Looks bad in the newspapers and upsets civilians at their breakfast.
 
HomeHome  GalleryGallery  Latest imagesLatest images  SearchSearch  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  
Latest topics
» Royal Marine Light Infantry, Chatham
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyToday at 7:57 pm by Petty Officer Tom

» H.M.S. Forester
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyToday at 4:07 pm by johnex

» Colonel Edward William Bray, 2nd/4th Regt.
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyYesterday at 8:49 pm by John Young

» Did Ntishingwayo really not know Lord C wasn't at home
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyYesterday at 10:53 am by Julian Whybra

» Samuel Popple
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyYesterday at 8:43 am by STEPHEN JAMES

» Studies in the Zulu War volume VI now available
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Nov 09, 2024 6:38 pm by Julian Whybra

» Colonel Charles Knight Pearson
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 08, 2024 5:56 pm by LincolnJDH

» Grave of Henry Spalding
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyThu Nov 07, 2024 8:10 pm by 1879graves

» John West at Kambula
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyThu Nov 07, 2024 5:25 pm by MKalny15

» Private Frederick Evans 2/24th
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Nov 03, 2024 8:12 pm by Dash

» How to find medal entitlement Coker
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Nov 03, 2024 10:51 am by Kev T

» Isandlwana Casualty - McCathie/McCarthy
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Nov 02, 2024 1:40 pm by Julian Whybra

» William Jones Comment
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 01, 2024 6:07 pm by Eddie

» Brother of Lt Young
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 01, 2024 5:13 pm by Eddie

» Frederick Marsh - HMS Tenedos
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 01, 2024 9:48 am by lydenburg

» Mr Spiers KIA iSandlwana ?
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 01, 2024 7:50 am by Julian Whybra

» Isandhlwana unaccounted for casualties
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 01, 2024 7:48 am by Julian Whybra

» Thrupps report to Surgeon General Wolfies
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyThu Oct 31, 2024 12:32 pm by Julian Whybra

» Absence of Vereker from Snook's Book
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Oct 25, 2024 10:59 pm by Julian Whybra

» Another Actor related to the Degacher-Hitchcock family
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyMon Oct 21, 2024 1:07 pm by Stefaan

» No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Oct 19, 2024 12:36 pm by Dash

» Alphonse de Neuville- Painting the Defence of Rorke's Drift
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Oct 18, 2024 8:34 am by Stefaan

» Studies in the Zulu War volumes
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyWed Oct 16, 2024 3:26 pm by Julian Whybra

» Martini Henry carbine IC1 markings
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyMon Oct 14, 2024 10:48 pm by Parkerbloggs

» James Conner 1879 clasp
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyMon Oct 14, 2024 7:12 pm by Kenny

» 80th REG of Foot (Staffords)
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Oct 13, 2024 9:07 pm by shadeswolf

» Frontier Light Horse uniform
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Oct 13, 2024 8:12 pm by Schlaumeier

» Gelsthorpe, G. 1374 Private 1/24th / Scott, Sidney W. 521 Private 1/24th
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Oct 13, 2024 1:00 pm by Dash

» A Bullet Bible
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Oct 12, 2024 8:33 am by Julian Whybra

» Brothers Sears
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Oct 11, 2024 7:17 pm by Eddie

» Zulu War Medal MHS Tamar
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Oct 11, 2024 3:48 pm by philip c

» Ford Park Cemetery, Plymouth.
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyTue Oct 08, 2024 4:15 pm by rai

» Shipping - transport in the AZW
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Oct 06, 2024 10:47 pm by Bill8183

» 1879 South Africa Medal named 1879 BAR
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Oct 06, 2024 12:41 pm by Dash

» A note on Captain Norris Edward Davey, Natal Volunteer Staff.
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Oct 06, 2024 12:16 pm by Julian Whybra

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 
Rechercher Advanced Search
November 2024
MonTueWedThuFriSatSun
    123
45678910
11121314151617
18192021222324
252627282930 
CalendarCalendar
Most active topics
Durnford was he capable.1
Durnford was he capable. 4
Durnford was he capable.5
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Isandlwana, Last Stands
The ammunition question
Durnford was he capable. 3
Durnford was he capable.2
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
The missing five hours.
Most Viewed Topics
Please Do Not Post Ads on Our Forum
Google Chrome new standards imposed
Isandlwana, Last Stands
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
In deference to other online platforms discussing the history of the Anglo-Zulu War of 1879
The missing five hours.
ISANDLWANA SURVIVIORS
The ammunition question
Recent Members To The ZULU WAR 1879 Discussion & Reference Forum ( A Small Victorian War in 1879)
Pte David Jenkins. 'Forgotten' Survivor of Rorke's Drift Returned to Official Records
Top posting users this month
Julian Whybra
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
Tig Van Milcroft
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
SRB1965
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
warrior3
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
John Young
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
Eddie
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
Kev T
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
Petty Officer Tom
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
MKalny15
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
STEPHEN JAMES
carbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_leftcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Barcarbines   at Rorke's Drift Bar_right 
New topics
» Colonel Edward William Bray, 2nd/4th Regt.
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyYesterday at 8:49 pm by John Young

» Samuel Popple
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyTue Nov 12, 2024 3:36 pm by STEPHEN JAMES

» Colonel Charles Knight Pearson
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 08, 2024 5:56 pm by LincolnJDH

» John West at Kambula
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyMon Nov 04, 2024 11:54 pm by MKalny15

» How to find medal entitlement Coker
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyFri Nov 01, 2024 9:32 am by Kev T

» Frederick Marsh - HMS Tenedos
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyThu Oct 31, 2024 1:42 pm by lydenburg

» Did Ntishingwayo really not know Lord C wasn't at home
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyMon Oct 28, 2024 8:18 am by SRB1965

» Thrupps report to Surgeon General Wolfies
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Oct 27, 2024 11:32 am by SRB1965

» Brother of Lt Young
carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Oct 26, 2024 9:52 pm by Eddie

Similar topics
Zero tolerance to harassment and bullying.
Due to recent events on this forum, we have now imposed a zero tolerance to harassment and bullying. All reports will be treated seriously, and will lead to a permanent ban of both membership and IP address. Any member blatantly corresponding in a deliberate and provoking manner will be removed from the forum as quickly as possible after the event.  If any members are being harassed behind the scenes PM facility by any member/s here at 1879zuluwar.com please do not hesitate to forward the offending text.  We are all here to communicate and enjoy the various discussions and information on the Anglo Zulu War of 1879. Opinions will vary, you will agree and disagree with one another, we will have debates, and so it goes. There is no excuse for harassment or bullying of anyone by another person on this site. The above applies to the main frame areas of the forum. The ring which is the last section on the forum, is available to those members who wish to partake in slagging matches. That section cannot be viewed by guests and only viewed by members that wish to do so. 
Fair Use Notice
Fair use notice. This website may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not been specifically authorised by the copyright owner. We are making such material and images are available in our efforts to advance the understanding of the “Anglo Zulu War of 1879. For educational & recreational purposes. We believe this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material, as provided for in UK copyright law. The information is purely for educational and research purposes only. No profit is made from any part of this website. If you hold the copyright on any material on the site, or material refers to you, and you would like it to be removed, please let us know and we will work with you to reach a resolution.
 

 carbines at Rorke's Drift

Go down 
4 posters
AuthorMessage
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyWed Jan 04, 2012 8:33 am

Hello

At Rorke's Drift, who were part of units armed with carbines, have you they traded for Martini-Henry rifles for the fight?

Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
Neil Aspinshaw

Neil Aspinshaw


Posts : 553
Join date : 2009-10-14
Location : Loughborough

carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyWed Jan 04, 2012 9:44 pm

Lugg carried a Swinburn Henry Carbine, Martini Henry carbines were not available in any significant quantities in early 1879
This is a swinburn in my collection, Natal Issue from Blakemore of London exactly the same as Luggs , and in the same VX serial number range.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Carbines are good for 600 yards so no reason to change from the weapon they knew
Back to top Go down
http://www.martinihenry.org
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyThu Jan 05, 2012 7:05 am

Hello Neil

We need a better gun than a rifle, issue of firepower and close combat.

And the drill for shooting in battle, you will know something or you know someone

who know it?

Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Jan 07, 2012 7:51 am

Hi

Where are they? Experts of R & D?

Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
Chelmsfordthescapegoat

Chelmsfordthescapegoat


Posts : 2593
Join date : 2009-04-24

carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Jan 07, 2012 1:23 pm

Quote :
We need a better gun than a rifle, issue of firepower and close combat.
Can you expand on this Pascal.
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySat Jan 07, 2012 8:40 pm

good evening

In my opinion the guys at Rorke's Drift from units equipped with carbines have abandoned them to use infantry rifles , except Lugg...

Because for the firepower and melee is better, to be logical ...

I will like to know what think those who are familiar with this battle ...

good night

Pascal
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10909
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 68
Location : Melbourne, Australia

carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Carbine's at R.Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 4:53 am

Hi Pascal .
I'm fairly certain you didnt have a choice of weapons at R.Drift ! . If you were issued a carbine or rifle that was it ,
you couldnt go and change them like at a shopping store !!. Shocked
cheers 90th. Idea
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 6:53 am

Hi

But by taking the Rifle of those who were too sick to fight, there was the possibility of exchanging a carbine to a rifle, right?

Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
90th

90th


Posts : 10909
Join date : 2009-04-07
Age : 68
Location : Melbourne, Australia

carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Carbine's at R.Drift.   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 8:48 am

Hi Pascal .
I doubt it very much . Suspect .
cheers 90th
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 9:34 am

Anyway, we will never know the truth, as on almost everything else, but given the mass of unused rifles, that's what I would have done at the onset of 500.600, or 700 inDluyengwe ...

Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
Neil Aspinshaw

Neil Aspinshaw


Posts : 553
Join date : 2009-10-14
Location : Loughborough

carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 1:24 pm

At less than 200 yards there is no perceivable performance difference between rifle and carbine, especially if firing Mk3 rifle ammo. Recoil is greater, but thats it.
Back to top Go down
http://www.martinihenry.org
barry

barry


Posts : 947
Join date : 2011-10-21
Location : Algoa Bay

carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Carbines at Rorke's drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 4:00 pm



Hi Pascal,

Neil is correct, the difference in the terminal muzzel velocity of the two cartridges would have been minimal, both were quite adequate to do more than the damage required to take the enemy out. Howvever, the carbine with it's shorter barrel and thus overall length was much easier and quicker, because of it's shortness, to traverse quickly ( shorter traversing arc) . Thus, in theory at close ranges experienced troops should have been able to fire of more shots quickly and accurately than those equipped with the MH.
The counterpoint to this, and the one fact that earned the MH its battle honours in that action was that armed witha a MH with its bayonet fitted, the defending troopers were enabled to bayonet the Zulu long before they could get up close and personal to use their short stabbing spears. The reports go that many Zulus at RD were shot at close range through the neck, and before a reload could be done with the MH, the next enemy presented at the parapet and the bayonet was very effectively used.
Because much of this action was conducted at very close ranges, many troopers also pulled out their pistols, as this was a QF solution, and blazed away (cf : my earlier post on Trooper Hunter NMP) to very good effect. The results speak for themselves.
To my knowledge there were very few carbines at RD, only the NMP troopers there had them.
As an aside , during ther night phase of the attack on th RD garrison, the thatch on a roof was set a blaze, and the rising thermals from the roof fire took burning bits of grass quite high in the sky and in so doing illuminated the night sky and the enemy lurking downwind in the darness where they thought they were safe. Now the snipers deployed into the tower of stacked mielie bags then got to work and sent those heavy 480gr MH slugs far downwind, with great effect , into a very demorailzed enemy.

barry
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 4:06 pm

Hi Barry , Neil and all others...

And for units equipped with carbines, orders for the shooting are the same as in the infantry?

The commands "front rank, present...fire!" were not adopted by the British infantry until approx a year after the zulu war.

The historically accurate commands for a volleys fire would have been ?:

"at 100 yards, ready...present!"

The yardage would be adjusted as needed by the section leader.

Each soldier would then present his rifle and count silently to himself for a count of three.

He would then discharge his weapon without any command to fire.

The British adopted a "fire" command soon after the onset of the Zulu war, whereby the section leader had final authority as to whether or not to release the volley, depending on if there was still a target present.

And for a independent fire?
The commands is ?
Only "independent fire !"

Independent fire could be twice as lethal as volley fire but use up three times as much ammunition.( 12 rpm with Independent fire and 4 rpm with volley fire )

Ex: With a independent fire, a soldier uses 100 rounds in 8 minutes and 20 seconds and affects four Zulu warriors.

Ex: With a volley fire a soldier uses 33 cartridges in 8 minutes and 20 seconds and affects two Zulu warriors.

4% of hits for the Independent fire and 6 % for the volley fire .

Apart from the first shooting of the Cavaye company at Isandhlwana , at 800 yards in the Zulu right horn,the infantry fire starts at 400 yards.

And for units equipped with carbines ?


Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 4:25 pm

Hey, hey Gary ,new information !

So if in independent fire lights can be 12 minutes with a MH ,with a carbine shots can be drawn even faster?

How?

But melee to one against one, African warrior is not the weight against a British soldier well trained in combat with the bayonet as his shield does not protect it of the British Steel and its arms are too short.

Without a rifle or a musket with bayonet, such as a policeman with his carbine...

The African triumph ?

Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
Chelmsfordthescapegoat

Chelmsfordthescapegoat


Posts : 2593
Join date : 2009-04-24

carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptySun Jan 08, 2012 6:13 pm

I'm sure this has been covered before.
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




carbines   at Rorke's Drift Empty
PostSubject: Re: carbines at Rorke's Drift   carbines   at Rorke's Drift EmptyMon Jan 09, 2012 7:43 am


Back issues of the ancients topics, that's great, it helps to see it a fresh look to have a new approach for new members to provide information at times unknown ...

And players who come on this forum without being registered, may also recover, many ideas ...

Cheers

Pascal
Back to top Go down
 
carbines at Rorke's Drift
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Rorkes Drift
» rorkes drift.
» Rorke's Drift VC's

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
WWW.1879ZULUWAR.COM  :: ZULU WAR BATTLES-
Jump to: