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» James Conner 1879 clasp
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» Gelsthorpe, G. 1374 Private 1/24th / Scott, Sidney W. 521 Private 1/24th
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» Alphonse de Neuville- Painting the Defence of Rorke's Drift
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 No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman

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Dash




Posts : 49
Join date : 2024-02-15
Location : Somerset

George - No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman Empty
PostSubject: No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman   George - No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman EmptyFri Oct 18, 2024 5:05 pm

Good evening all,

I wonder if anybody can help with the following.

The wife (Jane) and two children of George Williams were placed on the married establishment 21/2/1872, does anybody know the names of the children?

Ideally one of the children will be called Mary Ann, if this is the case a theory of mine has legs, if not it comes to a sudden halt. I imagine this has been researched many times before.

On the 25/11/1879 Thomas Newman, Lance Sergeant 1/24th Regt. married Mary Ann Watts, age 20, widow, daughter of George Williams, Private 1/24th Regt. at Gosport.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

On the 1881 Census Thomas is with the battalion at the infantry camp at St.Botolph’s in Essex, he is recorded with his wife Mary Ann and two children Elizabeth Ann aged 2 and Charles Thomas aged 10 months. Elizabeth’s place of birth is recorded as ‘Cape Colony’, Charles as Portsea, Hants.

A typed record shows a birth for Elizabeth being recorded as Cape Town, South Africa in the year 1877-78.

As Mary is recorded as a widow on the marriage record and Elizabeth was born before the marriage to Thomas, my next question is simple, was Mary previously married to a member of the 24th Regiment who was killed during the war. To be a widow at 20 and be associated to the 24th Regiment may suggest such a scenario.

The obvious candidate would be No. 1919 Henry Watts, but that may be a little simplistic. A marriage would probably have to have taken place in South Africa (no record found), did it? If it did is it recorded anywhere? Watts’ effects were claimed by a sister, which although not conclusive could be significant.  

It is very possible that there is no connection to Henry Watts, the one to Thomas Newman is clear.

Any help is very much appreciated.

Regards
Dash
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Tim Needham

Tim Needham


Posts : 308
Join date : 2011-10-18
Location : Cornwall

George - No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman Empty
PostSubject: Re: No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman   George - No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman EmptyFri Oct 18, 2024 10:15 pm

Good evening Dash,

I've had a quick look at my CD copy of Norman Holmes' 'The Noble 24th' (which includes amendments/updates by the late Alan Baynham Jones) and found the following:

WATTS Henry - Private - 1-24/1919 - 1st/24th
Born: England
Married: Mary Ann Williams at King William's Town, South Africa (Licence applied for at King Williams Town 26/3/1878), she had her parents consent as she was a minor.
Service Details: Posted to Gibraltar in October 1872.
Appointed Drummer no date.
Resumed duties as Private 1/9/1872.
Served during the Kaffir (sic) & Zulu Wars 1877-8-9.
Effects registered for claim by his sister under AGL81 - E/77277/18.
Honours/awards: South Africa Medal 1877-8-9 "Clasp 1877-8-9" .
Death: K-in-A Isandlwana Mountain, Zululand 22/1/1879.
Footnote: Anne Clarkson - Western Cape Archives King William's Town

So according to this, Henry's wife was indeed one Mary Ann Williams.

(The footnote suggests a possible record in the Western Cape Archives? - although I'm not convinced they are based in KWT)

Regards,

Tim
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Dash




Posts : 49
Join date : 2024-02-15
Location : Somerset

George - No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman Empty
PostSubject: Re: No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman   George - No. 799 George Williams and his son-in-law No. 243 Thomas Newman EmptySat Oct 19, 2024 12:36 pm

Tim,

Very many thanks for the reply and the information you supplied.

It is nice that when you think something looks right the evidence supports that view.

Regards
Dash
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